Chinese Kung Fu

Discuss shaolin longfist, white crane or other styles. Theory, practice and applications. Please stay on topic.

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Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:44 pm

Hello, I am very new to Martial Arts. I have been doing a lot of internet research and I am totally confused. I am an athletic 52 yr old male, and I have chosen to learn combat Tai Chi. I think because of the learning method of going slow, the flowing with the enemy and the efficiency of the actions taken. This does not mean I know what I am talking about or any disrespect to other martial arts. The problem is that I can not find Chen Tai Chi or any type of combat Tai Chi in my area, Valparaiso, IN. but I did find a well educated Chinese instructor who when I spoke to, laughed when I said combat Tai Chi. He stated that what I want to learn is Chinese Kung Fu in the Tai Chi style. After signing on for a month, the next thing I know I am learning how to kick forward and around. Not easy for any athletic 52yr. My quesiton is that is he teaching me combat Tai Chi, or Kung Fu or both or neither? If not, then what do you suggest? Thank You.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby yeniseri » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:46 pm

What does your training entail?
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:06 pm

After 3 lessons, this is what was covered. Coordination with hands, feet, motions with hands in relative to feet, kicking front and high with heel, kicking high circular, contacting top of foot near ankle, front block twisting waist counter with front punch forward.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby yeniseri » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:07 am

Thanks!
Have you had any martial experience before?

What will the present martial curriculum for combat taijiquan?
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:29 am

I do not have any experience and there is no cirricullum
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby yeniseri » Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:52 pm

Kind of odd that you did not receive or was not told what the training consisted of!

At a base level, you would need to know how to punch and kick (involving balance, stages of proprioception, i.e. kicking level to various heights) stattic then shift to a 2 step process (movement and execution of basics). Usually learning Combat taijiquan is convoluted at best.
1. Zhanzhuang (post standing)
2. Taijizhuang (postures from the form
3. SIlk reeling exercises
4. Starting a form
5. Individual posture training (repetition of single postures)
and this is the short list!!!
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:20 pm

You nnever answer the original inquiry
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby wpgtaiji » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:37 pm

Yes he did. It is your fault that you dont understand what he wrote.

Besides, you are being ripped off. The teacher is forcing you to HIS method, not teaching you what you want to learn. There is no such thing as "tai chi style"! It is a marketing tactic to take your money. You want to learn Taiji, and there have been lots of excellent suggestions.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:43 pm

Sorry, but I do not see suggestions. Maybe my mobile device does not get all the mssages
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby wpgtaiji » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:31 pm

Yianie wrote:Sorry, but I do not see suggestions. Maybe my mobile device does not get all the mssages

You asked "My quesiton is that is he teaching me combat Tai Chi, or Kung Fu or both or neither? If not, then what do you suggest? Thank You."... and it was answered. What else do you want? An in depth explaination of why? Do you want us to explain 2000 years of martial arts history? Lots of writing does NOT a clear question make.

Wiat for it.. spoon fed martial arts... on wait! That doesnt exist! You were given an idea (which is infinitely more than what you gave us), now the work is up to you.

Ah F*(k it! You want a suggestion: YOUR TEACHER IS LYING TO YOU! GET YOUR MONEY BACK AND FIND A NEW ONE THAT TEACHES TAI CHI ONLY! Forget about combat taiji for now! If you are intelligent (which you seem to be because you are asking), after you have learned Tai chi for a bit, the teacher SHOULD teach you applications. That is a clue.

Now, the difficult part to the answer is, applications have NOTHING to do with combat, so it looks like you are buggered... 99++% of tai chi people have no idea what or how to teach self defence with their art. You do the math. That said, the 1% are excellent!
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Yianie » Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:32 pm

Thank you
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby SzJoska » Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:57 am

Hi everybody, I wanna what is best for first style external or internal kung fu? (like Hung Gar or Xingyiquan). I tried Shotokan karate, but only 2-3 months and i get 8.kyu.
I'm 184 cm tall and 72 kg, and my fitness is i think too low, i tire very fast (my heart i think).
I wanna ask that too i don't know that what's better can i learn from book Liang Shou-Yu and Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming: Xingyiquan especially the 5 elements (fists), or Jesse Tsao: Compact Tai Chi: Combined Forms to Practice in a Limited Space, or would be better to continue karate?
I wanna have stronger body, better fitness and self defense skills, and I prefer Xingyiquan.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby John the Monkey mind » Tue Mar 26, 2013 4:42 pm

SzJoska wrote:Hi everybody, I wanna what is best for first style external or internal kung fu? (like Hung Gar or Xingyiquan). I tried Shotokan karate, but only 2-3 months and i get 8.kyu.
I'm 184 cm tall and 72 kg, and my fitness is i think too low, i tire very fast (my heart i think).
I wanna ask that too i don't know that what's better can i learn from book Liang Shou-Yu and Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming: Xingyiquan especially the 5 elements (fists), or Jesse Tsao: Compact Tai Chi: Combined Forms to Practice in a Limited Space, or would be better to continue karate?
I wanna have stronger body, better fitness and self defense skills, and I prefer Xingyiquan.


You have more hope with the Xing Yi book as its a simpler style than Tai Chi, but you would need the DVD,the Taiji ball DVD is also a good place to get the mechanics of concepts like stone ball and dragon back although it will not be referred to as such those are Xing Yi concepts in the YMAA Taiji ball. I learn the 5 elemets form from the book and DVD (the form on the DVD is not the same as the form in the book, its the short form but ignore that and work from the form in the book wile getting the feel and dynamics from the form on the disk), I had the advantage however of having studied the 5 fists with an instructor although without the form. I think my form needs work but I am making progress.
Have you got access to a training partner?
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Dvivid » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:39 am

I agree with John. Before you study the martial techniques of Xingyi, or whichever style you choose, conditioning exercises are necessary to improve your health, structure, and fitness, and the Taiji Ball patterns are a great way to develop the entire body quickly.

http://ymaa.com/publishing/tai_chi_DVD/ ... qigong_DVD

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"Avoid Prejudice, Be Objective in Your Judgement, Be Scientific, Be Logical and Make Sense, Do Not Ignore Prior Experience." - Dr. Yang

http://www.ymaa.com/publishing
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby SzJoska » Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:11 am

Ok thanks, I' m thinking about to start Shotokan or WTF Taekwondo, because in my city here are just these trainings what i like (no Xingyi or Taiji, no chinese martial arts).
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby SzJoska » Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:14 am

I will see if is here a Shotokan dojo that teaches the traditional way, I'm not into competitions, I like more the martial arts and the self defense to study and be more powerful and fit.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby Dvivid » Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:06 am

If you're seeking power and fitness, I would also suggest this DVD would be a perfext match for home-training:

http://ymaa.com/publishing/dvd/external ... ioning_dvd

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"Avoid Prejudice, Be Objective in Your Judgement, Be Scientific, Be Logical and Make Sense, Do Not Ignore Prior Experience." - Dr. Yang

http://www.ymaa.com/publishing
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby SzJoska » Tue Oct 29, 2013 4:11 pm

Thanks all of you for the great answers. I don't have a training partner and i was training in Shotokan in the last year but just only 5 month, now i can't afford it, and i don't know if i will return to it or not (i feel a little too exhaustive from it). Now i'm thinking between theese two (Shotokan and Xingyiquan) that i wanna learn one of this, but it's difficult because i must learn from books and from internet videos, and preferrably at home, where isn't enough place for some Shotokan katas, but i can exercise the 5 fists of Xingyiquan.
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby brer_momonga » Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:00 am

I think practicing regularly and eating well is more important than the style you train.
Hopefully you're making progress with your fitness goals.

Shame though, that you are unable to find a practitioner of Internal Chinese Martial Arts in your area and sorry to hear that your Shotokan dues got too expensive. I hear that though, my tuition constantly strains my budget.

What is it that draws you to Xingyiquan? It's difficult to find folks who teach Xinyi, Bagua, etc. Is there anyone in your area who teaches Tai Chi but "used" to train kung fu?
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Re: Chinese Kung Fu

Postby SzJoska » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:33 am

I Live in a small city here are just Shotokan, Aikido, Taekwondo, some wrestling, Box classes and some poor self defense class, but these are very expensive. Here are just glebes and meads (fields), that are far away and you can't exercise in the park because it's too noisy and it's full of children and people (nobody practises in parks and you were then a weird here). I bought a book a few years ago: Xingyiquan: Theory, Applications, Fighting Tactics and Spirit (in hungarian, because i'm hungarian) and so The One movie with Jet Li and I began to love that style. I soo from the book that the five fist are easy enough to learn and i can exercise this in the flat too, don't need so much place. (I'm a kung fu fan and i watched lots of kung fu movies and have some books too, Tai Chi Chuan too) My fitness is weak and i hate running, but i loved strengthening exercises, so therefore i thought one internal style would be better for me, (can't do Karate kata's in the flat it requires too much place) the only problem is here aren't any kung fu classes :(
Here a lot of man don't even heared of these styles and hasn't got the brave to began some training only from books and videos, even i don't know if I will have enough energy to stay with this style and practice it for life or for long period. There are times when i just feel the question is this will be good for me enough, will I be able to protect myself ?
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