Comparing YMAA basic kicks with Shaolin Temple Kicks

[jetle25]

What up. I'm taking shaolin classes now how they teach the front kick, and crescent kicks are slightly different from YMAA Long Fist. Of course nothing major but more detail orientated. Front Kick I mean just raising the leg straight up in front. So let me explain both schools technique to give a better picture.

YMAA

Front Kick- Kick straight up. toes pointing up. Keep upper body from bending forward. Up and down as fast and high as possible. Right leg kick you raise left arm up for a overhead block and right arm straight down between legs to protect the groin.

Outside Crescent. Same execution of Front Kick. Then at top of the kick open up the hip of the side kicking and bring the leg down in a forceful arching manner slappign open palms, stopping by brushing your foot against the floor pointing downward.

Inside Crescent- same execution as front. Top of kick rotate hip inward towards opposite side of the kicking leg. Bring leg and bend knee slightly to create a forceful slap kick arching downwards slaping sole of foot.

Shaolin Kicks

Front- Get into read position. Block upwrds with both hands by slapping back of hand into the opposite hands open palm. Then forcing both arms out straight opening your chest wide and point left toe out. Step with left foot and raise right leg just like YMAA front kick. When landing right leg land with toes on ground on the inside middle of planted left foot. Must be swift, and quiet for the landing. Landing ensures proper balance and safety . Arms always straight out and upper body rigid and straight.

Outside Crescent - same technique as above. But just at top rotate hip out. and slap outside of foot with both palms. Same landing as Front Kick. Downward technique is not like YMAA forceful straight leg crescent. More sideways pushing motion. Yet must be done fast and brought down quickly and forcefully.

Inside Crescent - Same as above but inside rotation of hip. slap sole with opposite sides arm.

So the real big differences I noticed between YMAA and my Shaolin school is more the landing and placement of the foot after executing the kick, and the outside Crescent kick.

The outside Crescent at YMAA was really about wide openign and very very forceful bring down of the leg like an axe. Then landing with teh leg and foot to teh side toes pointing stopping it by brushing the floor.

Shaolin still stressed wide opening and maximum stretch but bringing down the leg wasn't as forceful but more pushing and arching at the top of the kick landing with the kicking leg, toes pointed, knees slightly bent, next to the planted stable opposite foot.

The Shaolin front kick did not do the upper hand block with groin block. But thats more of schools choice or tradition I believe. But I feel the groin block is a lot smarter.

Of course both schools stressed maximum speed, kick to be in front to protect groin, and maximum height to stretch.

What I learned from Shaolin was that they have a different get ready stance for kicks. and how your upper body and hands should be doing while executing the kicks. The difference in the landing. And especially the different in bringing down the leg in an outside Crescent.

Shaolin stressed compact stright forward hips where the legs shoot straight up with minimal uupper body bending. Never leaving the hips wide open long enough to protect the groin. Only opening up when exectuing a crescent which is for hitting at a different angle.

SO sorry if this is very long and rambling. But I wanted some opinions from teh YMAA guys. COnsidering I did take lessons there and I feel Dr. Yang and instructors know their dren. But I know this SHaolin guy knows his dren too. NOt saying anythign is wrong but I do think the extra things I learned at Shaolin is useful adn good technique wise. But I do question the power of the outside crescent compared to YMAAs which I felt was very powerful but maybe dangerous in the landing leaving hips slightly open and balance issues if my foot were to get kicked out by leaving it hanging out when landing. The Shaolin compact balanced landing ensures safety for teh groin and not tripping over yourself and ability ot launch another kick fast.

So let the reponses come.

Pizzles

[jetle25]

Blah, Yeah I know its a bit over analytical in a freaking kick, but to me it extremely important just because building bad habits will bite you in the butt one day. I was hoping someone like Walter would respond cause I did train with him and seemingly very knowledgable.

On another note. YMAA never really stressed that my feet be pointing completely straight ahead while in a horse stance. My ankles feel like they are gonna bust out in shaolin classes but its improving, though I can't squat as low because of my inflexible hips and ankles.

The current classes I'm taking just seem to stress a lot more on smaller details that I was never constantly bugged about in other classes before. I'm sure they are important and they seem to push me physicaly.

[Inga]

quote from jetle25 : "YMAA never really stressed that my feet be pointing completely straight ahead while in a horse stance."


Absolutely bad habits should be avoided. They are hard to unlearn, I know from experience. I was surprised at your comment about feet placement. This is something that is highly stressed in my classes. Your foot position is key for strong root and getting your hips to open up during kicks and change of stance. I would speak to your instructor about your concerns, and especially about the feeling of pain (if this what you mean by "bust out"). I am sure you will get positive and helpful feedback.

[Inga]

Hi Sergey, no joke. I am not proficient, which means expert or adept. I am adequate at many of the basics, I have only been training for a short time. But thank you for the compliment. Cheers Inga

[DOM]

there is more then one way to skin a cat.I have found that every style and every master do things differantly and have a differant spin on how to train.Some are slighty differant others are much differant.It all depends on what they are trying to accomplish.I do not beleave there is just one right way of doing things.I have practiced, researched,and trained many diferant styles of Asian Martial arts and I feel one needs to do this some were along the way.But not intill you have trained in one system for a long time and have a very good understanding of that system.IMO no soonen than 5 years.I have gained from every style I have came incontact with and find simularities than differances in styles.Just keep doing it the way they say and in time you will figuer out why it is done one way compaired to the other way you learned

[dc]

this is just me:

nowadays, a lot of shaolin people train contemporary wushu basics. the shaolin kicks you're describing above describe the wushu kicks.

NOW, i started at YMAA and learned that way first...the question is whether at ymaa there is a greater emphasis on body and hip movement because of master yang's crane training (i know he influences his longfist with such) or whether that is the traditional longfist way to do it.

does that make sense? i really don't know the answer. i've seen videos of masters whose longfist really looks more like contemporary wushu, but also the opposite as well.