Breathing & Chi Circulation CONFUSION

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Breathing & Chi Circulation CONFUSION

Postby FlyingDagger » Mon May 09, 2005 6:45 am

Hi, im hoping some of Dr Yangs Boston students might be able to help me here, im pretty confused about which breathing method i should be doing, and where i should be visualising my chi going, i have lots of points of confusion, and i just read Dr Yangs book 'The Root of Taiji Qigong' and instead of enlightening me it confused me further...

With the 'spine wave' exercise i have been taught to inhale chi to the dan tian then exhale and release the stomach (daoist breathing) and move the spine in a wave like motion - expanding and contracting the chest and letting the motion flow into the arms. Now i thouhgt i was just getting to grips with this exercise, but i read that with Daoist breathing there should always be an inhale as you move chi from your tailbone up your spine.... So was my previous method wrong.. and te book also said you can get injured by not using the correct breathing.

This method also seems to contradict the way i have been doing some of my qigong, and also my form, where i would inhale while contracting and exhale while pushing forward etc... however to inhale as the chi (or movement?) goes up the spine would require 4 breaths per move instead of the standard 2.... which also seems wrong...

I feel like im just babbling on now so ill wait for some responses and go into detail at peopels request....

Hope you understand what i mean, and hope to get some responses as im confused as which method to do, and if one or the other is going to injure me

Many thanks!
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spine waving

Postby dc » Mon May 09, 2005 11:31 am

this is going to be an incomplete answer, but when i do spine waving, i coordinate the backward movement of the tailbone with the inhale (abdomen in) all the way up the spine. just before i manifest the movement in my arms, i begin the exhalation.

as far as right/wrong goes, i remember in one crane soft qigong class, master yang gave the option of inhaling or exhaling at the beginning or end.

just remember to focus on the movement first, and without knowing it you will start leading qi where it has to go...like leading a cow on a leash master yang once said; slowly and evenly.
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Postby FlyingDagger » Mon May 09, 2005 2:20 pm

another passage from the book stated that it must be an inhalation, as then you are leading the chi, but if you exhale up the spine then you are pushing the chi which will stagnate it. this seems to contradict the way ive been taugh to do a spinal wave, and it also seems to be the oppisate of how movements are done in the form i.e. with an exhalation as you move forward/press/settle etc...

o dont really have much feeling for chi at them minute, and certainly arnt moving chi around my body and up my spine, im just visualising it at the minute, but wherever the mind is and all that....

Thanks
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Postby Tosh » Sun May 15, 2005 2:39 pm

You shouldn't lead your qi up your spine while exhaling reverse abd breathing (there are exeptions) but you can lead the qi up your spine while inhaling and let it exit through your arms while exhaling. Just like you do with grand circulation while doing normal abd breathing.

Don't worry about it just do exactly what Dr. Yang describes. By the way it's much harder to have a good feeling of qi doing rev. abd breathing then doing normal breathing.
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Postby FlyingDagger » Mon May 16, 2005 5:07 am

1. Previously i have been exhaling, doing the spinal movement and moving forward/settling all in one

So now then during my form practice i must inhale the movement up my spine, THEN move forward and settle the movement with an exhale?

2. Also with the opening Qigong movement where the arms are raised up with an inhale, then lowered with an exhale - this seems to be backward to me now as after reading the root of qigong book it states that with reverse breathing chi is brough inwards with an inhale, and expands outwards with the exhale - however with this movement the directions are to lead the chi down to the dan tian WITH THE EXHALE - is this alright? doesnt this contradict the previous rule? can someone explain this please

Many Thanks dc and Tosh!
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Postby Tosh » Mon May 16, 2005 6:40 am

With the qi gong forms (at least the one I know) you should just follow dr Yangs advice. When he tells you to Inhale then you inhale it doesn't matter if you do rev or normal breathing.


Previously i have been exhaling, doing the spinal movement and moving forward/settling all in one
So now then during my form practice i must inhale the movement up my spine, THEN move forward and settle the movement with an exhale?


It's possible to do it like that, don't worry about that just do what feels best.

Also with the opening Qigong movement where the arms are raised up with an inhale, then lowered with an exhale - this seems to be backward to me now as after reading the root of qigong book it states that with reverse breathing chi is brough inwards with an inhale, and expands outwards with the exhale - however with this movement the directions are to lead the chi down to the dan tian WITH THE EXHALE - is this alright? doesnt this contradict the previous rule? can someone explain this please

Note that when you do small circ with rev abd breathing you also bring the qi down to the dan tien. But with this movement you should let the Qi sink into the dan tien. You don't have to bring the Qi upwards more important is to let it sink on an exhale so that you have a strong feeling in dan tien and a strong root.
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Postby FlyingDagger » Mon May 16, 2005 7:19 am

With the qi gong forms (at least the one I know) you should just follow dr Yangs advice. When he tells you to Inhale then you inhale it doesn't matter if you do rev or normal breathing.

but some of the advice seems to contradict itself - for instance exhaling and bringing chi to the surface - but then exhaling and settling the chi to the dan tian

don't worry about that just do what feels best

im just worried to be doing the wrong method, or in fact the oppisate of what i should be doing, ive previously been doing a couple of things wrong and been corrected, and at first the new method feels wrong as im so used to the old way, then after a while it feels right, and if i were to try the old method again then that feels wrong... im just scared to rely on my feelings as they can feel right even though theyre wrong, and i dont want to get pracicing something wrong for months/years to build bad habit... or even injure myelf!?

Just really confused about breathing at the minute, which i should be doing, when, and why. Got people telling me either is fine, or just to do like this, then i hear the oppisate, or i read somewhere there are rules not to do one such specific thing, so i just dont know which method to practice and when...
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Postby Tosh » Mon May 16, 2005 11:33 am

When you do normal or rev breathing it's most of the time te same only rev is more agressive. Like Taiji, when you attack you exhale when you neutralize you inhale it doesn't matter.
Exhaling normally is an extending movement. But you can also discriminate an internal movement. It's kind of hard to explane, the best thing you can do is read as much from dr Yang that's possible, or better try to find .
I experienced myself that reversed inhaling is a somewhat more internal upwarts movement and reversed exhaling is a somewhat a more downwar movement.
But with the starting position, leading the Chi to the dan tien, you shouldn't lead the chi from your breath to your dan tien but the chi from your upper body, drop your shoulders, and let it sink, kind of an feeling of lettin go on exhaling
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Postby FlyingDagger » Mon May 16, 2005 1:30 pm

Thanks, Tosh, think thats relaxed me for the time being, back to practice

Cheers!
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