small circulation and experiences

Discuss Qigong, its ideas, theories and practice. Please stay on topic.

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Postby mark wilson » Mon May 23, 2005 3:40 pm

hi, iam new to the forum .i would like to comment on the sensations
of itching and skin crawling this means it is an indication of the presents
of chi in your body i have been told to ignore this and that my focus is not
strong enough the idea is to have warmth in the dan tein .then circular the chi .i to gave electric shocks to people i think these things are an indication of chi present in the body.i have found though experience
go slowly with every thing to do with the mind and bodyand do not force
any thing be gentle with the qi gong practice.
i have been doing qi gong and meditaion for over 15 years and have
had on problems .some unusual senations but no problems.
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Postby jon2658 » Sat May 28, 2005 5:45 pm

yeah, ive given up on paying attention everytime i get those sensations and generally just focus upon drawing down through the crown of my head and creating a feeling of warmth in my dan tien before i circulate it up my back and over the top of my head again. am finding it more effective, too, in terms of relaxation, to keep the breathing soft, deep and steady.
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qi gong

Postby mark wilson » Mon May 30, 2005 2:22 pm

i have been going to a teacher (who is a tcm doctor and asked him if
he would teach me qi gong) and while i have been doing basic qi gong
for a very long time i only found out about circulating in the last 3years
from reading dr yangs books and going to local classes but infortunately
in my area in australia they do not know how to do the circulation
correctly(ie first get the dan tien warm etc) this omition is the most
important part to begin the foundation qi in three years of trying the
circutation i achieved very little but good concentration and relaxation
now after three months of doing only imagining a colored ball in
my dantien and getting the warmth . to my amazement the doctor
said i have my foundation qi .as i can focus on my dantien all day
long now i am always warm and have a lot more energy to do every thing
believe it or not i had chronic fatigue 5 months ago.and now that
i have my founation qi i am tired by the end of the working week
but not exhausted.but i do find the small circulation difficult
are the doctor said it is needed to advance to the higher levels
which i imagine takes very long to achieve
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Postby Dvivid » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:38 am

Dr. Yang's book 'Small Circulation' will be published in the Spring '06. In the meantime, read the first book in the series:
Image

http://store.yahoo.com/ymaa/qigmedembrea.html
"Avoid Prejudice, Be Objective in Your Judgement, Be Scientific, Be Logical and Make Sense, Do Not Ignore Prior Experience." - Dr. Yang

http://www.ymaa.com/publishing
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Postby jon2658 » Sat Jun 25, 2005 9:59 am

yeah, ive bought that book, and ive gotten some useful ideas from it; however, i would also say that it is very advanced in terms of the concepts and ideas. i think that it will definately be a book that i pick up from time to time and discover something new to build upon the things im already doing, when my understanding has increased. i bought a really good book -daniel reids, complete guide to chi-gung. i like this one alot. very useful for the basics. it explains chi, theories, equates chi alongside a western paradigm of understanding (in terms of medicine), provides a number of exercises, descriptions of the ways to breath, posture, and the sensations to expect. this last part was very useful. i think its quite difficult to understand the things you are experiencing with chi, so it is useful to have an author who comments in depth on it.
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Postby mark wilson » Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:27 pm

hi , i have a question for you do you have a teacher or are you
doing the practice from a book only? as most of my study has been from
books ( mostly doctor yangs)and other authors the problem with where
i live most of the practitioners of qi gong and martial arts arent very
good even the experienced one .or maybe my expectations are to high
on how good they should be .anyway i realised after going around to
different schools that the teachers where not very good and i new
more theory than they did and after talking to a chinese doctor i went
to for acupuncture and told them my experiences . he said that the ones
that can speak english well dont know much and the ones that are
"masters " cannot speak well , but he has said i can talk to
him about my experiences while practicing qi gong .this comment is
not ment to degrade those people practicing in my area. i am sure they have experiences of their own but i did realise that these people were not doing their practice properly from my readings .one thing i have
learnt is most of the work is solitary (ie you have to practice daily).
i find doing the practice is good for me it prepares me for my
working day better and is very enjoyable and refreshing.
regards mark
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hi

Postby jon2658 » Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:43 am

hi...thats a fair question, i think. i do have senior teachers, the problem is, that they all live in london. I live in wales, about 150 miles away, so the teachers only ever come down about 4-5 times a year and teach us chi gung. i do however, do a lot of breath work within aikido- we have really good teachers there all the time who, i think, seem to know what they are talking about. i also try to go to as many seminars as possible- eg, bk frantzis- his seminars are really good. yes, i do use books too. i find that doing all of the above, seems to reinforce my practice alot. sometimes something doesnt quite make sense to me and its only through a cross reference of my own practice, seminars, my teachers, and, yes, books, that i am able to make sense of my experiences. for example, when i first started, i had great trouble understanding how you drew energy through your feet, up your legs, to the centre. i remember one of our teachers trying to explain it- i didnt really understand. it was only through daily practice, additional research that i was able to grasp what was being taught and do it for myself. of course, in an ideal world, we would all have a chi-gung master, who could teach us-= 6hours a day on a daily basis, but that aint always possible, i think you know that. however, i do feel that books are useful and i wouldnt dismiss them; although, they will never take you to the higher levels they will give you a great foundation, but as i have explained, i would never use them by themselves. as you have said, daily practice is the key. it is the most important thing, and even without a chi-gung master to aide you i think you can still achieve an awful lot more than if you did nothing at all. i find that books, my martial arts instructors, seminars, etc, all compliment my chi gung, and that is the key word- compliment! they are not, and never should be the basis of your trainin, i think. tell me about yourself. how is your chi-gung going? i am always interested in hearing from other people, to compliment my own experiences, lol!
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chat about my self

Postby mark wilson » Tue Jul 05, 2005 10:11 am

hi jon,i have been interested in martial arts since i was 10years old
i am now 45 years.i have been practicing since 1982 .ive tried may
different arts karate ,hapkido, wing tsun which i have been practicing
on and off for 15 years.ihad 6 years formal study with a good teacher
and the rest of the time on my own ,taichi chaun and hsingi also 18
months of ba ji with the same teacher who taught me wing tsun.
there was a period of 5 years of work commitment when i was unable
to formally train so i practiced by my self when i could.at the moment
i do hsingi only as at my age i realise form researching doctor yangs
books i should do softer arts than wing tsun .hence the interest in the
wu dang system.i have left my teacher as he moved out of the area
and when weird delving into the dark side of chi for want of a better
word.
i have been trying to find a new teacher but thats not easy
i have sort of trod on some instructors' toes' by mistake one attacked
me phsyically the other mentally. just a small note to say i get
along will most people they say i am easy going . the instructor
who hit me in the pretext of a sparring demonstration kicked me
in the abdomin .which hurt for three days he was a professional
fighter for 20 years 11 times grand champion(all comers) .at the time
he was 58 yearsold retired obvcourse.i didnot retalliate but next class
he singled me out to make an example of me .he told me to go into
a karate stance (forward ) an used all his power to push me over
but i had a good teacher and i absorbed his force which he didnot
expect and was stunned i did no more and didnot return to his classes
again.some teachers have big egos unfortunatelly.so icontinue to
search for a local teacher but none are very good and if they are
they have large egos.
thats one reason i train by my self a lot. i work a lot on my fighting spirit and have done for 15 years now.i realised 15 years ago the importance of the figthing spirit for daily life and to be able to use
the techniques if nescesary.insidentlly i have never thrown apunch
in anger i found the better my figthing spirit the better i got a long with people and beleive this or not more dosial.i didnot expect to be a
toughter person and more dosial at the same time.
human nature can be strange or the opposite at times

talk to you on your next reply bye mark
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Postby jon2658 » Wed Jul 06, 2005 12:39 pm

thats quite a background. i would love to be able to learn bagua or hsing-i over here, but unfortunately it is very difficult to find the teachers, if there are any at all where i live (cardiff, wales, uk).

i'm only 24 and have not had nowhere near the same depth of training as yourself. i've been practising a southern style kungfu for 5 years and aikido for 1 year. as i said before, all my higher seniors are based in london so they only come down about 3/4 times a year. although i still continue with the kung fu i think that i am limited by the limited amount of learning opportunites. i do teach myself, but i am sure that you will appreciate, that with the extent of my learning, i do not feel anywhere near qualified to be teaching, which is why i started aikido. it is like having the top instructors present on a daily basis, and i feel as though i am learning again. also, it is alot softer than the kungfu, with a completely different spectrum of principles- entering, blending, etc- which you are more than likely familiar with yourself.

i agree with you entirely about ego. i see too many people in my kungfu club, only just acquiring their black belts (no doubt you've seen this many a time too), strutting around the class, both hands clasped over the knot of the belt looking very smug, and possessing an inflated opinion of themselves because of it.

i was disappointed to read of the instructor kicking you in the abdomen like he did. we get so many idiots who join our class thinking they are bruce lee, but they soon drop out because they cant hack it and they dont have the discipline. i like to think that martial artists, especially the higher ranking ones are nice people because you would expect them to have had enough time to discipline and tone their character more appropriately.

i do the chi-gung mainly by myself. what did you mean when you said that you dipped into the darker aspects of chi-gung?
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qi gong chat

Postby mark wilson » Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:42 pm

hi jon, no not me my instructor that taught wing tsun. i had an absence
of about 5years from his teaching and when i came back he had been
taught by his master the art (for want of a betterword) chi projection
i watched in his class for three years how he was able to project his
chi towards other people (his students)and stop them in there tracks.
i dont know what he was doing(in practice or technque) it was unbelieve
able. until i saw this my self i did not believe in this .he said there were
only 2 people in australia that could do this projection . all i could see
was the danger in this .his ego was very big and appeared to show
off to his students all the time and would show let his students feel
what this projection was like.i felt it too. to me i felt paralised i could
not move a muscle for a few minutes. wheather you believe this or
not is your choice but be wear of that stuff its not good to delve into
the changes i saw in him were not good he became more agressive
angrier etc .the changes were subtle but they were there.
i ended up leaving not saying anything to the other students
they seemed mezmerised by him i saw a bighead showing off.
any way theres alot out there to be cautious about. what he was interested in i was not so i left.i donot now why but i come across
some unusual things in the martial arts world ' ha ha' .i must be the
weird one' haha.'
i just ignore that stuff and enjoy my martial arts theres a lot
of good practitioners around and people i would personally rather be
in their company than the other type.

bye for now regards mark
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Postby FireEyeC » Sun Jul 31, 2005 10:11 pm

And I thought it was just me :D

Whenever I meditate I get constant vibrations/chills and that go different directions through my body continuously until I stop. Its quite strange. And my dan tien area feels like, numb almost and warm. Then when I circulate it in grand circulation I get more tingles and vibrations. So this is normal? :D
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Postby FireEyeC » Sun Jul 31, 2005 10:15 pm

And I thought it was just me :D

Whenever I meditate I get constant vibrations/chills and that go different directions through my body continuously until I stop. Its quite strange. And my dan tien area feels like, numb almost and warm. Then when I circulate it in grand circulation I get more tingles and vibrations. So this is normal? :D
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reply fire eye c

Postby mark wilson » Tue Aug 02, 2005 3:30 pm

hi fireeye c, i get different feelings to you i imagine we are all diferent
in our experiences as for me i mainly do small circulation at the moment
i now wait to get my dantien warm then circulate but now i notice my
bones get warm as well there my only feelings at the moment. my
teacher says going up (ie in direction) is harder than going down
and that there are three gates that are dificult for the mind guiding the qi to pass .i just finished my exercise this morning and found going in
the opposite direction easier than the normal way which i thought a bit
strange.anyway i felt good at the end of the practice .
regards mark
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