When is the 5 stepping patterns taught in TC training?

[jfraser]

I am learning Yang Xiao Jia, The training began with "13 jin" and the 8 direction of the compass, There we a few essential movements from the long form, and now I am learning a very difficult and detailed Jin with most pivoting on the balls of my feet, and small stepping that is also detailed and much of it is go behind an opponent's leg in many diferent ways, and in very close quarters with various jin included. Dr. Yang refers to this as the 8 gates, I think.

When is the 5 element stepping taught in TJ?

Anyone learned this set of movements in at large frame or medium frame?
What is your experience with this set?

James

[SunTzu]

The 8 directions (Bagua/ trigrams) and the 5 elements (Wuxing) together form the 13 postures. If that's true than I guess it's taught right around the same time when learning the 8 directions.

The 8 directions concern the eight basic methods of energy release in TJQ :
Wardoff, rollback, press/push, squeeze, pluck, split, elbow and shoulder/bump

The 5 elements concern the stepping methods of TJQ :
Advance, Withdraw, Look right, Gaze left and Central equilibrium.

[Dvivid]

You'd get better responses to a TJ question if you posted it in the TJ forum...