Pusing Hands and Resistance

[Meerkat]

I have read a lot about pushing hands and seen many videos on the topic, but some years ago I was first introduced to pushing hands with a partner in front of me as part of a regular morning practise I used to do with a gongfu exponent here in Beijing. We were practising Shaolin forms at the time, but to "take a break" at the end of our practise we engaged in pushing hands. As we approached each other to being the pushing hands set he wanted to teach me, I was very relaxed and expected this to be sensitivity training. However, he used a lot of resistance to my movements and when he attacked he offered significant resistance to my deflections. Afterwards, in my less than adequate Chinese, I asked him about this and he told me that the softer version is used to build sensitivity, but that the harder, resistive version is used to build strength for real combat.

I had never heard of this before. Is this a common training tool in taijiquan? Is it particular to some styles and not to others? It certainly made you use your body a lot more to generate the force required to deflect incoming attacks. Thoughts anyone?

[Josh Young]

you say he was a gong-fu expert and he did shaolin forms

for him it is correct, but it is not absolute nor is it the standard in taijiquan

in other words:

just because he is right, does not mean he isn't wrong
and just because he is wrong, does not mean he isn't right


Gong-fu expert sounds silly!!!
gong-fu can be translated into the word "expertise" the short form of which is itself: "expert" so gong-fu expert can translate to "expert expert"!!!!

I know however that what is meant is CMA enthusiast, because nobody can gain expertise in all Chinese Martial Arts without living many lifetimes. Those who know of the details of things are best called Scholars.

Skill speaks for itself, what did his have to say to you?

[John the Monkey mind]

You are right Josh. Pushing hands type exercises are common to a grate many styles and adapted by individuals to supplement a grate many more. Force can be useful but it will stop you developing a true Taiji type sensitivity and skill as Cheng Man Ching's student Wolf wrote you can become a pushing hands demon however neither you nor your partner will gain the deep skill of Yang Taiji. However not all styles look for that and being able to upset your opponents game with a well targeted force is valued as a martial skill and can be of a high level skill in its self just not classic Yang style pushing hands.

[Meerkat]

Just to clarify: I said he was a gongfu exponent, as in a practicioner of Chinese martial arts, not an expert. I could have said a wushu exponent, but I did not want it to be confused with the more athletic performance style of martial arts.

It is interesting to hear your feedback on this. He also practiced the softer side of pushing hands to train sensitivity and so forth, but he also incorporated this type of strength training into his practice which I thought was very interesting, since I had not encountered it before. While this individual had a background in Shaolin styles, he also was a taiqichuan teacher so for him this was a core part of his taiqiquan studies. It just so happened I was learning some Shaolin from him because that was what I was interested in learning at the time. These days however he practices Baguazhang and Taijiquan more than his Shaoling roots from when he was younger.

[Josh Young]

thank you for the correction, i apologize for my misconception, I am sorry.

I do however stand by the saying:

just because he is right, does not mean he isn't wrong
and just because he is wrong, does not mean he isn't right

I have trained with several forms and methods that bear the name taijiquan, some do use more external techniques, like Chen style, which openly acknowledges that it is composed of Daoist techniques combined with shaolin, which is why it is both external and internal.

However the softer clearly overcomes the harder once the skill improves, while in the early stages the harder overcomes the softer because it isn't soft enough. Pushing on a good player is like pushing on a cloud, there is no resistance, they are like a cotton ball, however being pushed by one is like being carried by the wind, which is always soft but can destroy all that which resists it. Being struck by a good player is a lot like being hit by a truck that you never saw coming.

It is not that difficult to exploit resistance with good taiji skill, it gives you something to push on, but it is a mistake to match resistance with resistance, the method is as yin and yang, not yang and yang. This is why it is called taiji-quan, because of the dynamic reciprocity, which is an actuation of daoist principals of balance and harmony.

In all good groups players must learn to deal with resistance, there is no way to become good at taiji without learning to apply it, abstract theory and form work is worthless without application practice with real force and real speed. However several schools teach that while resistance has application in training, it is not the method itself but rather what the method exploits.

think cloth, rock, scissors, the soft overcomes the hard, the hard overcomes the pointy and the pointy overcomes the soft, taiji is no different