History of Martial Arts in China and India

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History of Martial Arts in China and India

Postby kennethtennyson1 » Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:41 pm

Martial Arts in China and India

Through my readings of martial arts history, I discovered a disturbing trend. Many nationalistic Indians are trying to lay claim that they discovered martial arts and kung fu, karate, and all of the East Asian Martial arts originated from them along with the transmittal of Buddhism. Unfortunately, India today in terms of written historical text, is in a state of flux. For the last few decades, the Hindu nationalistic parties have been distorting historical texts and in general the history of India. Accurate historical texts are dismissed, children are taught fabrications, and sometimes outright lies that are pro-Indian and pro-Hindu. Many of these distortions have engendered their way into the internet age on websites and have been self propagating especially with Indian writers. The result of this is that much of the history of India in present time, has been distorted in some way as to make it difficult to separate fact from fiction. The purpose of this article is to dispel the myths that are currently being propagated by Nationalistic Indians. In this article, Kung Fu will relate to Chinese martial arts, and Shaolin Kung Fu relates to the Kung Fu style originating in the Shaolin temples.

To begin with, very few historians believe that martial arts originated from one place and spread throughout the world. Most military powers in their history have invented some form of martial arts, such as wrestling and self-defense in ancient Sparta and Greece. Most historians believe that many of the martial arts even in Japan (lost in legend with oldest accounts possibly 27B.C.), Korea (Silla Kingdom 57 B.C.), Southeast Asia, and South Asia developed independently to some degree and perhaps influenced each other after their invention. Most of these martial arts share similarities possibly through influences on each other, but most likely secondary to the fact that armed or unarmed combat by human beings employs similar principles and the human body is similar. The reason why the East Asian Martial Arts are so popular today is due to the fact that they have been so well codified, their ease of use and effectiveness in self-defense, their use of the entire human body and scientific principles for self-defense, their focus on personal development, and especially the popular media.

The Indian belief that India is the origin of Kung Fu (Chinese Martial arts) and most Eastern martial artists center on their contention that Bodhidharma (Pu Tai Ta Mo in Chinese or Daruma Daishi in Japanese) the creator of Zen Buddhism came from India, notably south India, and spread Zen Buddhism along with martial arts from India to China sometime in 450 AD. To begin with, history does not know the origins of Bodhidharma, as most of the biography relating to him has been lost in legend. Bodhidharma has also been associated with the discovery of tea (unlikely as the Chinese have historical records and even an ancient encyclopedia stating that they have been drinking tea since 200 B.C. or so) and that he could bore a hole into a wall by looking at it. Further, no historical efforts have accurately shown where he originated from, and many accounts differ. Some suggest India, others suggest Central Asia and perhaps Tibet.

Secondly, historical records suggest that Bodhidharma might have taught the Shaolin monks meditation exercises in 500A.D.; however, historical evidence has shown that the Shaolin monks during this time and before this time (the Shaolin temple predates Bodhidharma) harbored retired soldiers, who taught the monks self defense that they had learned during military training. Not only that, various meditation exercises such as those of Taoism, existed before this time that predates Bodhidharma by a millenia. The Shaolin monks, in order to protect themselves from bandits and criminals around 500A.D, began to codify what they learned into a "Shaolin" Kung-Fu style; however, the development of Kung Fu (or general martial arts in China) goes back millenia before this.

The oldest evidence of Kung Fu, or Chinese martial arts, as it is practiced by the military goes back to the Zhou dynasty (1111-255 BC). The first written history of Chinese martial arts comes from the reign of Huangdi, the Yellow Emperor of the Zhou Dynasty (1122-255 BC). Huangdi was a famous military general, before becoming China’s leader and wrote a lengthy treatise about martial arts. He is also credited with being the founder of China’s oldest known martial art – chang quan (long fist). Further, the Taoist monks were practicing physical exercises that resembles Tai Chi (or a soft form of Kung fu) at least during the 500B.C. era. In 39-92 A.D. , the "Six Chapters of Hand Fighting", in the Han Book of Arms were written by Pan Kuo. Also, the Hua To, "Five Animals Play" - tiger, deer, monkey, bear, and bird, was developed during 220 A.D. As stated earlier, the Kung Fu that is practiced today developed over the centuries and many of the later additions of Kung Fu, such as the Shaolin Kung Fu style, later animal forms and the drunken style were incorporated from various martial arts forms existing later on in China or have accurate historical data relating to their inventor.

Third, unfortunately, there is very little historical evidence to lay claim to the Indian contention that their various martial arts predates East Asian martial arts. Mythology does exist in India as to their creation of martial arts going back a few thousand years, but mythology exists in every culture relating to the origins of martial arts going back a few thousand years. Mythology does not equate historical evidence. In fact, the various Indian martial arts, especially Kalaripayate, had very few practitioners before the advent of the modern age and especially the "Bruce Lee" era. Contemporary Indians in India were just as fascinated with Kung Fu as regular Americans in America were. Very little historical evidence suggests that Indians were practicing their martial arts as it is in its current form even a few centuries ago. What historical evidence exists suggests that the East Asian martial arts predates the current Indian martial arts. Whatever similarities exist are either due to the innate requirements that the human body requires in order to defend itself, or were additions to the Indian martial arts, possibly through Mongol or Muslim conquest later on or within the last century with international trade.

Another interesting concept is the idea of "chi" or life force energy. Many Indians believe that they invented this concept with their ideas of "prana." However, historical evidence suggests that various cultures have a similar concept, even within SouthEast Asia and South America. Historically, "Chi" developed from Taoism and Lao Tse Tung from concepts that predate 500B.C., and this invention predates that of Buddhism's introduction introduction to China. Further, Tai Chi, which is the martial arts exercise developed with Taoism also predates Buddhisms introduction to China, and historical books related to its breathing exercises go back to at least 500 B.C. Finally, Indian contention that Karate and Kalarippayat share common ancestry due to their similar sound is doubtful as both words are anglicized constructions of multiple Japanese and Indian words, both of which have totally opposite meaning. Kara-Te in Japanese means "Empty Hand." In India, "Kalari" is an arena for combat; "payat" stands for a system of combat.

The historical inaccuracies that are being propagated by nationalistic Indians on the web and in print are concerning. Even today, some Indian children are being taught that the East India Trading Company was created in India, when in fact, it was a British company that took over India. As to the influences of the various martial arts of India and China on each other, no one knows as no true documented evidence exists. The oldest historical evidence for the existence of Kalarippayyat date back to the 8th-13th centuries A.D. However, it is a long stretch of the imagination to believe that all of the East Asian Martial Arts or even Chinese martial arts had their origins in India as historical evidence suggests that the Chinese martial arts predates the Indian martial arts. The historical inaccuracies are dangerous for the Indians, as the Indian martial arts should be a source of cultural pride for Indians. However, by stretching the truth, at times fabricating the truth, and making fallacies of reasoning, nationalistic Indians today are lending doubt to the whole history of Indian martial arts.

-Kenneth Tennyson, Ph.D
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Postby zipwolf » Mon Jun 13, 2005 3:43 pm

umm... .long fist is a relatively new style, even if we are talking about moslem long fist.

the oldest recorded in china is shuai chiao (although in a VERY different form to what its like now)
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Postby mah927 » Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:42 pm

Great article, can you please post some sources. I would like to read the sources, You have written something I have always wondered about. Thanks for posting.
MA
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Postby yeniseri » Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:48 pm

There are the remnants of an art popular in South India (Kerala) kalaripayyarit which is undergoing resurgance. It was once practiced by the Kshatriyas (warrior caste).
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Postby Lohan » Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:59 pm

I would also like some sources. Not questioning authenticity really, because, lets face it, we'll never know for sure. I would like to read them to expand my personal knowledge of the material.

There are of course many variables with this subject but it is always nice to read new, well researched viewpoints. I personally do not know at what point kung fu became a 'temple sponsored' activity. That would be a good thing to find out in this research. Like an above poster mentioned, early drawings i believe of what could be called shuai chao were done on a cave wall or something. But lets all face a truth real quick: as long as humans have been around, we have been fighting each other like any other animal. There is no contesting that india helped the evolution of eastern martial arts so i don't see what the problem is really. The only problem i see presented is some people in modern india wanting a piece of the american martial arts market ($$$). Which is fine because i'd like to know more about them anyways.
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Postby Flip » Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:07 am

Buddhism has it's foundations in the Vedic tradition which is, if memory serves, as old as 4000 years BCE (according to the ever popular "scholars.")

These ancient Hindu traditions spawned Buddhism, Jainism and Sikhism, along with Yoga, advanced meditation techniques, and a martial art.

While many traditions around the world have concepts of a 'life force' or prana or qi, no other tradition had one as developed as the indian sub continent did (at least not as far as we are aware).

I agree that it would be foolish to think that martial arts developed in one area and spread througout the world. I'm sure that by man's primitive origins, fighting was a regular part of life, and practicing fighting would be a natural step in evolution.

If anybody has interest in seeing the very striking similarities between ancient HIndu thinking and Buddhism and Taoism, I would suggest reading "The Upanishads" a collection of hindu meditations that range in age from at least a couple thousand years BCE to as recent as 300 or 150 BCE.
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Postby Walter Wong » Mon Dec 05, 2005 10:08 am

In every culture throughout history, people have been killing each other alot. Quite the motivation to figure a way to defend themselves. Every generation coming up with a slightly more efficient way of killing someone or someones. In a course of a few thousand years, these systems of combat have evolved to quite sophistication and efficient for individual dueling/street fighting to battlefield combat and tactics.
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Postby yat_chum » Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:08 pm

I recently read an article that said that ancient greece was the birth place of systematised martial arts.

“The Greek race is certainly well-known for its athletic and military achievements in the PreChristian era. In truth, we must credit them for both the word "athlete" and the ideal it expresses. It was also the Greek soldier who would represent the standard for the rest of the world to follow for centuries. The contribution of the Greeks to the evolution of the martial arts, as we presently know them, is now certainly evident. Fighting systems that have originated in both Eastern and Western parts of the world may indeed be linked to this ancient combat form.
Over 2000 years ago, the ancient Greeks had developed a brutal, all-out combat form which they named Panmahia. The term literally means "total fight". A sport form called pankration, or "all powers" in translation, was first introduced into the Olympic Games of 648 B.C.. It would soon become the most popular and most demanding of all athletic events. It integrated every physical and mental resource - hands and feet, mind and spirit - in the closest simulation of no-holds-barred competitive fighting that any culture has ever allowed. Only biting and gouging were prohibited. Anything else went, although the tough Spartan contingent allowed these, too, in their local athletic festivals. The techniques included a murderous mixture of Hellenic boxing and wrestling: hook and uppercut punches, full-powered kicks, elbowing and kneeing, joint locks, as well as numerous submission chokeholds.” ..... ”Practitioners displayed the power of pneuma (Gr. inner energy) by breaking stones and planks with their bare fists and driving their hardened feet through forged war shields.” ..... “Panmahia and the sport of pankration were basic to the majority of the Greek warriors who served under Alexander the Great during his invasion of India in 326 B.C. Many authorities now contend that this dispersal of unarmed techniques throughout the subcontinent contributed to the development of countless Asian martial arts which evolved soon thereafter, including Chinese kung fu, Okinawan karate, and Japanese jiujitsu.”
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Postby scramasax57 » Tue Dec 06, 2005 10:28 pm

this whole idea of systemized martial arts sprouting from one location and spreading throughout the world is pretty much ridiculous. fighting was extremely common. it doesn't take a huge intellectual leap to figure out that if you train for it, you'll be better at it. every culture has a "system" of fighting in that every culture's way of fighting has a certain flavor to it. some cultures, most notably the eastern ones, developed multiple systems and named them. it's much more feasable that all cultures discovered this idea on their own than only one culture thinking of it and somehow managing to spread it throughout the entire world without the benefits of modern communication and travel.
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Postby Walter Wong » Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:04 pm

When I was a kid I had a theory that Martial Arts came from aliens cause I didn't think people were smart or clever enough to figure out how to come up with such sophisticated powerful efficient fighting techniques in ancient times. :lol:
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Postby Bloodybirds » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:12 pm

Greetings to all from Houston. I have just joined this forum and found this discussion very interesting. It is traditional on other forums to briefly state backgrounds so I will just say the last 8 years I have studied with Sifu Jeff Bolt in Houston, Dr. Yang's senior student. Previous to that I studied Wudan Shaolin under a Shaolin master in Dallas for many years and spent years in NYC training under Master Leung Shum in Ying Jow eagle claw system. In other words, I love any bird system and Yang style taiji, Dr. Yang's style. We have some incredible old tapes of Dr. Yang and Sifu Bolt from the early to mid 80s and I have a tape of Dr. Yang from 1988 doing 150 Shaolin chin na techniques slow, medium, and fast. Combined with the knowledge from Sifu Shum's jow da cum na and 108 locks, it would be interesting to discuss the history of joint locking and grabbing techniques and how they evolved, if anyone cares to comment.

We certainly miss Dr. Yang visiting down here and hope some day to entice him here again. Until then, it is an honor to join this forum and stay in touch with others under the incredible tutelage of Dr. Yang and others who show a distinct interest in Chinese martial arts. I will comment on history later. Just wanted to say hello and pay my honor and respect to all members here. Stay warm and God bless.

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Postby Walter Wong » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:17 pm

Welcome to the forums. Master Yang is up here in Boston. Please do come visit and train with us when you can.
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Postby Bloodybirds » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:26 pm

I am planning to travel up there in the Spring and visit my Ying Jow school in NYC and then travel to Boston with my training brother Kevin Boyd, who you may know Walter. He has been up there many times and I believe is a certified assistant instructor in chin na with Dr. Yang as well as being an instructor with me down here. Kevin, a taiji instructor under Jeff, and myself hope to open a school here next year. In any event, thanks for the welcome, I look forward to the discussion.
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Postby Walter Wong » Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:31 am

Oh yes, I do know Kevin. Bumped into him many of times here at the Boston YMAA. He's a cool guy. 8)
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